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Topic: virus: Cult memes (Read 527 times) |
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deadletter-j
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How many Engstrom's does it take?
 
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Re: virus: Cult memes
« Reply #1 on: 2005-02-03 18:33:16 » |
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The parsed down phrase for their tactics could be:
"information sanitization"
In the memetic action network I envision, using open source movies made anywhere and duplicated everywhere, someone could do a 'tell all' on scientology and nobody would be targeted for retribution.
It would be a quiet film passed hand to hand across the country, with no real author, no sales, no paper trail.
That, and films about all sorts of things like that. The more people who make films about scientologists, the more the collective processing brain will be able to quietly strategize a way to deal with the issue.
Our fundamental meme is:
"give it away, make money off of the derivatives" - the problem solving network I propose would be the ultimate non-hierachical community. As an interlocking problem-solving internet, it would be whatever the people who work on it want it to be. By definition, it will only articulate the collective will.
And the collective will always smacks down those with negative intent.
information wants to be free!
-b
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Keith Henson [mailto:hkhenson@rogers.com]
> Sent: Thursday, February 3, 2005 02:39 PM
> To: virus@lucifer.com
> Subject: virus: Cult memes
>
> As a lot of you know, I am a refugee because of a certain cult in the US.
>
> Generally they manage to threaten editors enough to prevent stories
> (counter memes) about them from being published, major exceptions being
> Time's story "The cult of greed and power" back in 1991, and a few good
> series in newspapers, the most recent in California being Nanette Asimov's
> (niece of Isaac) story exposing Scientology/Narconon last year in the SF
> Chronicle. That got their bogus anti drug program tossed out the
> California schools.
>
> Another one hit this week in Buffalo NY. Mark Sommers, the reporter who
> did it, spent over a year working on the story.
>
> These URLs won't be up long.
>
> Enjoy!
>
> Keith Henson
>
> Day 1
> http://www.buffalonews.com/editorial/20050130/1056567.asp
> http://www.buffalonews.com/editorial/20050130/1055254.asp
> http://www.buffalonews.com/editorial/20050130/1056545.asp
>
> Day 2
> http://www.buffalonews.com/editorial/20050131/1060672.asp
> http://www.buffalonews.com/editorial/20050131/1067682.asp
>
> Day 3
> http://www.buffalonews.com/editorial/20050201/1064780.asp
> http://www.buffalonews.com/editorial/20050201/1051251.asp
>
> Day 4
> http://www.buffalonews.com/editorial/20050202/1064176.asp
> http://www.buffalonews.com/editorial/20050202/1008269.asp
>
> ---
> To unsubscribe from the Virus list go to <http://www.lucifer.com/cgi-bin/virus-l>
>
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Hijacking everything ever knew about anything.
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simul
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I am a lama.
 
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Re: virus: Cult memes
« Reply #2 on: 2005-02-04 14:14:21 » |
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Is CoV a cult?
A cult is merely a group of people who believe something that falls outside
of mainstream culture.
If CoV were bigger, people would *call* it a cult. Sure, we wouldn't think
of it that way. We'd be like "Hey, it's a harmless, if a bit juvenile,
philisophical discussion group". And they'd say, "You just think that
because you're in the cult and you're so brainwashed you don't see what it's
doing to you."
And they'd be right. As a member, I can't be objective about COV. Although
I, personally, do think it's harmless - I'm aware that I lack a certain
perspective.
And, as someone who has joined *several* of what people have described as
cults, I am aware that I lack a certain perspective on the issue in general.
I am, at this point, seriously thinking of investigating Scientology by
enrolling in some introductory programs. I'm aware that I will be sipping a
particular poison - but this is a poison that I have been sipping, without
notable adverse effects that have been reported to me, for some time now.
- Erik
----- Original Message -----
From: <global_hijack@speakeasy.net>
To: <virus@lucifer.com>
Sent: Thursday, February 03, 2005 6:33 PM
Subject: Re: virus: Cult memes
> The parsed down phrase for their tactics could be:
>
> "information sanitization"
>
>
> In the memetic action network I envision, using open source movies made
anywhere and duplicated everywhere, someone could do a 'tell all' on
scientology and nobody would be targeted for retribution.
>
> It would be a quiet film passed hand to hand across the country, with no
real author, no sales, no paper trail.
>
> That, and films about all sorts of things like that. The more people who
make films about scientologists, the more the collective processing brain
will be able to quietly strategize a way to deal with the issue.
>
> Our fundamental meme is:
>
> "give it away, make money off of the derivatives" - the problem solving
network I propose would be the ultimate non-hierachical community. As an
interlocking problem-solving internet, it would be whatever the people who
work on it want it to be. By definition, it will only articulate the
collective will.
>
> And the collective will always smacks down those with negative intent.
>
> information wants to be free!
>
> -b
>
>
>
>
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: Keith Henson [mailto:hkhenson@rogers.com]
> > Sent: Thursday, February 3, 2005 02:39 PM
> > To: virus@lucifer.com
> > Subject: virus: Cult memes
> >
> > As a lot of you know, I am a refugee because of a certain cult in the
US.
> >
> > Generally they manage to threaten editors enough to prevent stories
> > (counter memes) about them from being published, major exceptions being
> > Time's story "The cult of greed and power" back in 1991, and a few good
> > series in newspapers, the most recent in California being Nanette
Asimov's
> > (niece of Isaac) story exposing Scientology/Narconon last year in the SF
> > Chronicle. That got their bogus anti drug program tossed out the
> > California schools.
> >
> > Another one hit this week in Buffalo NY. Mark Sommers, the reporter who
> > did it, spent over a year working on the story.
> >
> > These URLs won't be up long.
> >
> > Enjoy!
> >
> > Keith Henson
> >
> > Day 1
> > http://www.buffalonews.com/editorial/20050130/1056567.asp
> > http://www.buffalonews.com/editorial/20050130/1055254.asp
> > http://www.buffalonews.com/editorial/20050130/1056545.asp
> >
> > Day 2
> > http://www.buffalonews.com/editorial/20050131/1060672.asp
> > http://www.buffalonews.com/editorial/20050131/1067682.asp
> >
> > Day 3
> > http://www.buffalonews.com/editorial/20050201/1064780.asp
> > http://www.buffalonews.com/editorial/20050201/1051251.asp
> >
> > Day 4
> > http://www.buffalonews.com/editorial/20050202/1064176.asp
> > http://www.buffalonews.com/editorial/20050202/1008269.asp
> >
> > ---
> > To unsubscribe from the Virus list go to
<http://www.lucifer.com/cgi-bin/virus-l>
> >
>
>
> ---
> To unsubscribe from the Virus list go to
<http://www.lucifer.com/cgi-bin/virus-l>
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First, read Bruce Sterling's "Distraction", and then read http://electionmethods.org.
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David Lucifer
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Re: virus: Cult memes
« Reply #3 on: 2005-02-04 18:48:57 » |
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Erik Aronesty wrote:
>I am, at this point, seriously thinking of investigating Scientology by
>enrolling in some introductory programs. I'm aware that I will be sipping a
>particular poison - but this is a poison that I have been sipping, without
>notable adverse effects that have been reported to me, for some time now.
>
Nice knowing you Erik ;-) But seriously, why Scientology? Is this kind
of an intellectual version
of thrill-seeking?
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hkhenson@rogers...
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back after a long time
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Re: virus: Cult memes
« Reply #4 on: 2005-02-05 12:52:35 » |
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At 02:14 PM 04/02/05 -0500, Erik Aronesty wrote:
>Is CoV a cult?
>
>A cult is merely a group of people who believe something that falls outside
>of mainstream culture.
Not at all. There are specific markers that define a cult.
First 4 from cult scale in Google.
... The Boyd Cult Scale. By George A. Boyd © 2003. A ... cult. The Boyd
Cult Scale uses 10 factors, each of which are ranked from 0 to 10. ...
www.mudrashram.com/cultscale1.html - 16k - Cached - Similar pages
The Advanced Bonewits' Cult Danger Evaluation Frame
... observers use the same methods of scoring and weighting each scale,
their comparisons ... quite a few large mainstream churches) are far more
“cult-like” than ...
www.neopagan.net/ABCDEF.html - 27k - 4 Feb 2005 - Cached - Similar pages
AFF's Cult Information Bookstore: cult help, books, periodicals ...
... Abstract. The Group Psychological Abuse (GPA) scale was developed from
a factor analysis of 308 former cult members' characterizations of their
groups. ...
cultinfobooks.com/detail.asp?product_id=CSJ11-01G - 12k - Cached - Similar
pages
Bonewits' Cult Danger Evaluation Frame
ISAAC BONEWITS' advanced CULT DANGER EVALUATION FRAME V2.6, ... Groups
which score towards the high end of the scale (ie, 150) are more than
probably not healthy ...
www.unc.edu/home/reddeer/tenets/00_bonewits.scale.html - 24k - Cached -
Similar pages
>If CoV were bigger, people would *call* it a cult. Sure, we wouldn't think
>of it that way. We'd be like "Hey, it's a harmless, if a bit juvenile,
>philisophical discussion group". And they'd say, "You just think that
>because you're in the cult and you're so brainwashed you don't see what it's
>doing to you."
>
>And they'd be right. As a member, I can't be objective about COV. Although
>I, personally, do think it's harmless - I'm aware that I lack a certain
>perspective.
>
>And, as someone who has joined *several* of what people have described as
>cults, I am aware that I lack a certain perspective on the issue in general.
>
>I am, at this point, seriously thinking of investigating Scientology by
>enrolling in some introductory programs. I'm aware that I will be sipping a
>particular poison - but this is a poison that I have been sipping, without
>notable adverse effects that have been reported to me, for some time now.
May I suggest that you try mainlining heroin instead? It isn't as
expensive and you won't lose as many of your friends.
Seriously, take a look here:
http://www.holysmoke.org/cos/scientology-christopher-reeves.htm
Keith Henson
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David Lucifer
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Re:virus: Cult memes
« Reply #5 on: 2005-02-05 15:16:42 » |
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Let's see how well the CoV does on the Boyd Scale (http://www.mudrashram.com/cultscale1.html)
Factor 1 Information Control — to what degree are followers not allowed to read materials regarded as group scriptures, texts or literature?
[0 - no reading material is prohibited]
Factor 2 Devotion for the leader — to what degree does the group encourage love and devotion to the leader of the group?
[0 - as First Host I'm probably closest to a leader and I don't know of any "devotees"]
Factor 3 Dependence — to what degree is the followers’ behavior specified and directed by group doctrine and leader commandments, so that this guides followers’ decisions?
[5 - hopefully Virians aspire to the Virtues and avoid the Sins]
Factor 4 Coercion — to what degree are followers manipulated to enter the group and to remain in the group by instilling fear, shame or guilt, by humiliation or public embarrassment, or by threats or emotional blackmail?
[0 - no coercion has ever been used to my knowledge]
Factor 5 Mystification — to what degree do followers learn a special language and interpretation of symbols that creates an alternate mindset from which they view reality?
[1 - we have a memetic lexicon which is kind of non-standard]
Factor 6 Dissociation — to what degree are followers asked to remain in an altered state of awareness outside of their grounded state of awareness, affecting their ability to function normally in their personalities?
[0 - I'm not even sure what this is about, meditation maybe?]
Factor 7 Identification — to what degree do followers identify themselves with an element of the Superconscious Mind (the spirit, their ensouling entity or a nucleus of identity) and detach from identification with their ego and self?
[0 - we don't believe in any of that mystical stuff]
Factor 8 Isolation — to what degree does the group cut followers off from relating to family and friends outside the group, and limit contact with society outside the group?
[0 - quite the opposite]
Factor 9 Cognitive Restructuring — to what degree does indoctrination from the group change followers’ beliefs about themselves and their relationships with other people, their moral values and their cosmological world view?
[5 - sometimes grokking memetics can be an epiphany]
Factor 10 Nexus of motivation — to what degree do followers’ goals and dreams shift from a personal focus to a spiritual focus, so that personal goals are postponed or abandoned altogether in favor of spiritual aspirations and group mission?
[1 - we're still trying to figure out a group mission]
So that adds up to 12/100, or 12% inside the fuzzy cult category. Sounds about right.
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Blunderov
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RE: virus: Cult memes
« Reply #6 on: 2005-02-07 00:40:40 » |
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-----Original Message-----
Erik Aronesty wrote:
>I am, at this point, seriously thinking of investigating Scientology by
>enrolling in some introductory programs. I'm aware that I will be
sipping a
>particular poison - but this is a poison that I have been sipping,
without
>notable adverse effects that have been reported to me, for some time
now.
[Blunderov]I've contemplated the same notion (in the interests of
research) but one difficulty seems to be that they try to stick their
hands in your pocket almost immediately. The mind recoils in horror at
the prospect purchasing a copy of "Dianetics", never mind actually
reading it.
---
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David Lucifer
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Re: virus: Cult memes
« Reply #7 on: 2005-02-07 18:15:32 » |
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Blunderov wrote:
>[Blunderov]I've contemplated the same notion (in the interests of
>research) but one difficulty seems to be that they try to stick their
>hands in your pocket almost immediately. The mind recoils in horror at
>the prospect purchasing a copy of "Dianetics", never mind actually
>reading it.
>
Dianetics is worth a read, for the humour value if nothing else.
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