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   Author  Topic: The International Meme Republic  (Read 1372 times)
ibrahim
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The International Meme Republic
« on: 2004-12-10 11:16:10 »
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David Lucifer
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Re:The International Meme Republic
« Reply #1 on: 2004-12-11 14:04:05 »
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Quote from: ibrahim on 2004-12-10 11:16:10   
I am a writer, currently researching a novel that explores the evolutionary potential of Memetic theory.  What I would like to know is, how do you think a state that was able to accomplish Memetic Engineering would function?  What would it be like to be an individual in this culture?  If the whole world was capable of constructing sophisticated, personalised, self-engineered memeplexes to define their personalities, would we still be human?


Since the state is the origin of these hypothetical memes we can probably assume that everyone infected with the memes would act in the state's interest, sublimating their own self-interest. So I would expect the culture to resemble totalitarian states like Nazi Germany or Communist USSR, except without the hypocrisy (assuming the leaders of these historical regimes were really exploiting the system in their own self interest).

What it would be like to live in this culture would depend on how effective the memetic engineering is. Is everyone infected or is there an active resistance? Are the people in power infected or merely exploiting the masses?
« Last Edit: 2004-12-11 14:08:43 by David Lucifer » Report to moderator   Logged
ibrahim
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Re:The International Meme Republic
« Reply #2 on: 2004-12-14 12:26:03 »
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Re:The International Meme Republic
« Reply #3 on: 2005-08-13 13:27:10 »
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ibrahim
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Re:The International Meme Republic
« Reply #4 on: 2005-08-15 08:56:20 »
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Re:The International Meme Republic
« Reply #5 on: 2005-08-15 12:38:06 »
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ibrahim
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Re:The International Meme Republic
« Reply #6 on: 2005-08-17 08:52:44 »
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Re:The International Meme Republic
« Reply #7 on: 2005-12-11 04:39:50 »
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You all should read Isac Asimovs foundation series! It was voted best trilogy over the lord of the rings, so its not smalltime. The series is about a secret society that engineers memes (amoung other things). Asimov's premis is that one can use mematics to not only predict the future, but knowing the future be able to change it (but only at a certain critical population point that humanity has not quite reached yet). The most brilliant mathemeticians predict a dark age to come, and they also make arrangements "to have it end sooner" using their foundation. The foundation uses many means of controlling the galaxy, including religion, commerce, and psychology. One can draw parallels between the foundation at varying stages and the way in which certain countries controlled earth throughout our history.

Thinking back upon it, I never thought of it like this, but what if they used mematics to start the dark ages in the first place? What if our darkages were created by a single group of master mematic engineers, who only created it so that their descendants could rise to power at the head of the new society that emerges?
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Re:The International Meme Republic
« Reply #8 on: 2006-04-16 20:54:32 »
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A Virian (Headbands Jim IIRC) once described the JudeoChristianIslamic meme as "wickedly successful." Consider that the  dark ages were consequent to Christianity's brutal elimination of memetic competition. I don't see your thought as a stretch.

Now consider the role of the US in the world today, the stunning effectiveness of the combination of churches and faux news in creating a memetic pandemic of terror, and the appended, rather sobering item. I call it sobering because there were good reasons to call the last time Christianity held so much relative power the "Dark Ages". It takes a scary degree of stupidity to give these legends credence, but it is even scarier to consider what degree of complete irrationality is required to imagine that anything about these bogey stories is ethically sustainable (Ultimately at the heart of the story of Jesus are the old, old stories of tribalism, bigotry and child sacrifice. Wonderful stories for the 21st Century?). Scariest of all is the thought that these dark times could be returned. The only glimmer of good news is that the younger you are, the less likely you are to give credence to this claptrap making (in Jefferson's words*) "one half of the world fools, and the other half hypocrites."**

Hermit

*Refer e.g. http://www.mindfully.org/Reform/2005/Jesus-Without-Miracles1dec05.htm and  http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jefferson_Bible.

**Not that I suggest bothering with any "Jesus" related claptrap. Ethics have improved enormously, even if, largely because of religion which finds change challenging, people haven't.


76% Say Jesus Rose from the Dead

Source: RasmussenReports.com
Dated: 2006-03-25

Survey of 1,000 Adults March 21-22, 2005

Did Jesus Rise from the Dead?
Yes    76%
No    14%

As Christians around the globe prepare to celebrate Easter, 76% of American adults believe that Jesus Christ rose from the dead. A Rasmussen Reports survey found that just 14% disagree.

African-Americans are more likely to believe in the Resurrection of Christ more than other Americans. Adults under 30 are least likely to believe this basic premise of Christianity.

Eighty-two percent (82%) believe that the man known to history as Jesus Christ actually walked on the earth. Seventy-eight percent (78%) believe he was the "Son of God who came to earth to die for our sins."

Seventy percent (70%) of Americans claim a Christian religious affiliation (either Evangelical Christian, Protestant, or Catholic).

Forty-six percent (46%) say they attend Church or other religious services at least once a week.

The national telephone survey of 1,000 adults was conducted March 21 and March 22, 2005. The margin of sampling error is +/- 3 percentage points with a 95% level of confidence.
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With or without religion, you would have good people doing good things and evil people doing evil things. But for good people to do evil things, that takes religion. - Steven Weinberg, 1999
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