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Topic: Truth or Fiction? Tales of Al Qaeda Cannibalism (Read 1714 times) |
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MoEnzyme
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Truth or Fiction? Tales of Al Qaeda Cannibalism
« on: 2007-07-10 16:12:19 » |
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I occasionally listen to Rush Limbaugh just to know what the right wing wacko propaganda noise machine will come up with next, since he seems to be at the heart of it. Yesterday, with some incredulity, I heard the following story offered up by Mr. Blowhard as the gospel truth . . . That Al Qaeda in Iraq was engaging potential converts to their cause in cannibalistic feasts by serving up their children to the prospective parental converts. Now I know these people (Al Quaeda) aren't nice people who live by a different and warped set of rules, but if anything ever sounded like a case fantastical demonization this was certainly it. I fail to understand how this works as a recruiting tactic even for the most barbarous. It sounds more like a boogeyman tale than anything from the Third Reich - at least there was some traceable if warped/evil logic to Nazi atrocities where I fail to see any here. So I felt the need to track down the sources on the internet, where I pinpointed it to a particular blogger - Michael Yon . . . apparently the only named source for this information who seems to have gotten it from second if not third-hand sources.
http://www.michaelyon-online.com/wp/baqubah-update-05-july-2007.htm
>>"No one can claim with certainty that it was al Qaeda, but the Iraqis here seem convinced of it. At a meeting today in Baqubah one Iraqi official I spoke with framed the al Qaeda infiltration and influence in the province. Although he spoke freely before a group of Iraqi and American commanders, including Staff Major General Abdul Kareem al Robai who commands Iraqi forces in Diyala, and LTC Fred Johnson, the deputy commander of 3-2 Stryker Brigade Combat Team, the Iraqi official asked that I withhold his identity from publication. His opinion, shared by others present, is that al Qaeda came to Baqubah and united many of the otherwise independent criminal gangs.
Speaking through an American interpreter, Lieutenant David Wallach who is a native Arabic speaker, the Iraqi official related how al Qaeda united these gangs who then became absorbed into “al Qaeda.” They recruited boys born during the years 1991, 92 and 93 who were each given weapons, including pistols, a bicycle and a phone (with phone cards paid) and a salary of $100 per month, all courtesy of al Qaeda. These boys were used for kidnapping, torturing and murdering people.
At first, he said, they would only target Shia, but over time the new al Qaeda directed attacks against Sunni, and then anyone who thought differently. The official reported that on a couple of occasions in Baqubah, al Qaeda invited to lunch families they wanted to convert to their way of thinking. In each instance, the family had a boy, he said, who was about 11 years old. As LT David Wallach interpreted the man’s words, I saw Wallach go blank and silent. He stopped interpreting for a moment. I asked Wallach, “What did he say?” Wallach said that at these luncheons, the families were sat down to eat. And then their boy was brought in with his mouth stuffed. The boy had been baked. Al Qaeda served the boy to his family.<<
I thought I would serve this up to the Church of Virus to see if anyone could offer anymore illumination/corroboration/debunking etc. To me it just sounds like the typical memetic bullshit of apocryphal storytelling. Even the documented cases of real human cannibalism sound nothing like this, and while I accept the inhumanity of Al Qaeda this sounds like over-the-top claptrap offered up for the idiotic consumption of dittoheads. What do Y'all think?
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I will fight your gods for food,
Mo Enzyme
(consolidation of handles: Jake Sapiens; memelab; logicnazi; Loki; Every1Hz; and Shadow)
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Hermit
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Re:Truth or Fiction? Tales of Al Qaeda Cannibalism
« Reply #1 on: 2007-07-11 06:23:14 » |
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I really don't know how your teeth survive listening to right-wing, wrong-always radio.
This 3-hand story smacks strongly to me of classic US propaganda techniques. "Our enemy is so terrible that the horrific things we are forced to do to oppose him are justified. It is sad we have to kill 50 civilians a day in aerial bombardments, but it is for the greater good, to protect you from an awful enemy that eats children." Bleh. This is exactly the same quality of work as all the stories - still utterly unsubstantiated by expensive investigations - that Saddam Hussein was torturing people by feeding them - alive - into shredders, etc. Indeed, I would not be stunned to learn that they originate from the same PSYOPS sources.
It is important to note that al Q'aeda instantiated, developed and remains emergent as a response to perceived horrors perpetrated by the West and by Western aligned Middle Eastern governments against the Palestinians, against the Afghans and against Islam. Prior to our stupid and unnecessary invasion of Afghanistan and illegal invasion of Iraq, al Quaeda was a small and relatively insignificant organization with limited support. Its ability to grab our attention and inflict visible damage on us, is only a small component of its current popularity. While we are both training and brutalizing its operatives, we also popularize its marketing line, "We are successful because Allah is with us." The management of al Q'aeda has repeatedly demonstrated exquisite awareness of public relations and the use of Q'oranic phrasing to extend its support base and improve its perception as a "holy" organization. Unislamic cannibalism - particularly involving the murder of other Muslims - and especially involving as it does, children - would rapidly destroy their popularity. So I think that al Q'aeda would be very unlikely to advocate - or even condone - such activity.
At the same time, the harm that rumors that they are doing this would inflict upon them offers short term benefits to the US. Firstly it possibly diminishes immediate support to al Q'aeda and makes it easier for potential informers to justify accepting "blood money" to provide information to the US despite the religious injunctions not to do this. "They eat children don't they" is not designed to strengthen their "moral superiority"! Secondly it forces al Q'aeda senior management to deny the rumors, allowing path and message analysis as well as HUMINT to potentially expose their management, courier channels, spokespeople and internal structures. The danger of course is that once it becomes known where this propaganda is originating (and it will), the religious spin (down to the exact "father of lies" quotations) which will be put upon it by al Q'aeda, with a commensurate decrease in the truth value assigned to anti-al Qaeda information, true or false, will have a major negative impact on America's already poor ability to alter perceptions in the Middle East.
While one might hope that somebody analysed this and decided that the short term benefits were sufficiently great to justify the long-term drawbacks; or even decided we have so little credibility left that this propaganda would help in the US to an extent that it cannot in the Middle East, a number of factors, not least the US leaderships apparent inability to look ahead more than a few weeks, makes me think it is yet another "clever" program, probably dreamed up in Washington and deployed to yield results matching internal USA political needs, with no heed to any future implications whatsoever. The report of this disinformation in US media can then be defended as "leakage" and ignored.
All the above said, look for "supporting evidence" to arise in the near future as the story results in increased brutality from field players on "our side", and a corresponding rise in brutality on their side. That is one of the inevitable - and expensive - consequences of believing your own extremist propaganda. As but one example, consider why we are increasing both global terror and our exposure to it by occupying Iraq." Saddam is an evil, evil man, who tortures babies and won't stop at anything till he nukes us..." If you have forgotten how this incessant flow of lies was used to get us into this mess, refresh your mind by spending a few minutes in our archives; they are replete with examples. Who needs talk radio when we have our own neo-ditto-conehead at hand?
Kind Regards
Hermit
Apropos of something, a wonderful example of skiing down the slippery slopes occurring in Evol-Psych. While Jefferson has been mentioned in that thread, nobody there has done the arithmetic on how old he was (42 IIRC), and how old Sally Hemmings wasn't (12 when she arrived, 15 when she had her miscarriage (according to her brother) during the return voyage IIRC), when they first started diddling together in Gay Paris.
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With or without religion, you would have good people doing good things and evil people doing evil things. But for good people to do evil things, that takes religion. - Steven Weinberg, 1999
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Blunderov
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Re:Truth or Fiction? Tales of Al Qaeda Cannibalism
« Reply #2 on: 2007-07-11 12:34:08 » |
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[Blunderov] A Muslim baked and dressed for the table in the manner of a suckling pig? By their memes ye shall know them. I have little doubt that such a thing would be considered a grave blasphemy in Islamic eyes and not well calculated to win hearts and minds. Add to this the difficulties involved in cooking an entire human being, even a fairly small one. A larger than standard oven would be necessary. A power supply less capricious than is commonly available in Iraq would also be necessary unless some sort of hangi was utilised. It would take time. At least 5 or 6 hours would be my guess.
A lot of trouble to go to for no apparent gain.
So, cui bono?
Hmm.
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Blunderov
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Re:Truth or Fiction? Tales of Al Qaeda Cannibalism
« Reply #3 on: 2007-07-11 13:03:56 » |
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[Blunderov] Roast leg of insurance salesman.
http://www.stratsplace.com/rogov/cannibal.html
Rogov's Ramblings
Cannibalism and the Culinary Life
Eating Our Brothers and Sisters
Let me start off by saying that whatever interest I may have in cannibalism as an aspect of the culinary life is not as perverse as it may sound at first glance. Truth is, it all started with the release in 1990 of Peter Greenway's film "The Cook, The Thief, His Wife and Her Lover". Although I leave film criticism in the hands of film critics, it has been my wont for many years to write about the culinary aspects of films that deal heavily with food. Because the Greenway film relates in great detail to the preparation and serving of food as well as to the dining out phenomenon, I wrote about it for several of the newspapers and magazines to which I contribute. One of the "courses" in the film involves the spit-roasting and then dining on one of the main characters. Greenway was not being perverse. He was simply making a point. Whatever perversity entered into the question came about when one of the magazines for whom I was writing insisted that my article about the film be accompanied by recipes - in this case, recipes for the cooking of human flesh.
Cannibalism is no stranger to our little planet as seventy two different groups of primates, fish and birds practice the eating of the flesh of their own species. Included among the cannibalistic species are chimpanzees, great apes and human beings. It is only humans, however, who eat the flesh of their brothers and sisters for ritual, shamanist or religious purposes and it is largely these issues with which anthropologists and sociologists involve themselves. When it comes to the realm of perceiving human flesh as an item of food to be imbibed for hedonistic pleasure, however, academic studies fall to the realm of psychology and psychiatry and even criminologists, and that because to most people, cannibalism has been one of the greatest taboos throughout history.
Despite the taboo, cannibalism was widely practiced until the 1960's among various tribes in Papua
New Guinea, some of whom ate human flesh for spiritual reasons and some simply because they thought it tasted good. Although some westerners considered that charming and exotic, cannibalism has rarely received a popular press in the Western world. Despite that, until the 18th century, many Europeans used crushed skulls, bone marrow and a variety of other human "parts" as medicines and even today a not insignificant group of people, especially in England continues to cook and eat placentas believing that this in some way "simply returns to the body what has previously been lost".
With only few exceptions has the question of cannibalism fallen to the consideration of gastronomes.
In one such case, Guy de Maupessant had written a short story in which a woman murdered her lover. In order to destroy the evidence, she cooked and ate him, in fact, serving him up to a group of friends who had come to dinner. Because he had never tasted human flesh and could therefore not describe its taste, de Maupessant could not finish the story and set it aside for several years. When the opportunity arose, however, he bribed the attendant at the Paris morgue and came home with the left arm of a young man who had died in an accident. The author cooked it and invited several friends to dine (he did have the courtesy to let them know in advance on what they would be dining). Several days later, he completed the short story. Marco Polo, who kept extensive diaries of his travels, also had occasion on which to dine on human flesh, and wrote that he found it "too sweet, too tough and not at all pleasing". Another well known explorer and diarist to dine on human flesh was Captain James Cook. Cook never recorded his pleasure or displeasure with this repast but as is well known to historians, he was eventually eaten himself.
Whatever exotic charms there might be in pondering in an intellectual fashion on cannibalism, there are several major problems, not the least of which is that the consumption of human flesh is illegal in every nation in the world. Even more important, of course, is that in modern society no person has the right, under any circumstances, to kill another person for the purposes of eating him or her.
There are two other factors that many will perceive as among the "down-sides" of cannibalism. First, there is a very good chance that people who partake of human flesh will develop kuru, a neurological disease similar to the Kreutzfeld-Jacobs syndrome we most often associate with Mad-Cow Disease. Many agree that both of the most notorious cannibals of our time, the fictitious Hennibal Lector ("Silence of the Lamb") and real-life serial killer Andre Romovich who killed and ate parts of fifty three of his victims both contracted this disease. Second, and from a more purely culinary point of view, most Westerners who have tried it agree that the meat of humans is about as tasty as that of lions or vultures, neither of which are considered particularly palatable.
Those who do insist on pondering on the subject might care to reflect that in the Peter Greenway film, the body of the lover was spit roasted and garnished with whole cauliflowers and turnips. Whatever one thinks of this form of revenge, culinary purists will be in general agreement that spit roasting is not the ideal way to prepare human flesh. In fact, there seems to be general agreement that the best means of preparing the meat of humans are similar to the methods used to prepare large game such as deer, elk and wild boars. Following, are several recipes that seem appropriate for those of us who care to ponder (and ponder only!) on the potential of dining on friends or foes. As to whether I have ever tasted human flesh - let it be said only that self-incrimination is always foolish. I will say, however, that the following recipes are the only ones that I have published that I have never prepared or tested. Oh yes - theoretical wine matches for the following theoretical dishes would be full bodied and mature Brunello di Montalcino or Chateauneuf-du-Pape.
Finally - and forgive me if I am being repetitive - let us keep in mind that this little piece and the recipes were written as a form of black humor. Reading and chuckling may be appropriate but considering the preparation of any of these dishes on anything but the intellectual level is both immoral and illegal. I will definitely not accept invitations to sample any of these dishes.
Marinated Leg of Person
1 leg, about 3 kilos
6 cups dry cider
1 kilo carrots, sliced thinly
8 medium onions, sliced thinly
16 juniper berries
8 leaves sage, chopped
1/2 cup butter
2 whole nutmegs, grated
salt and pepper to taste
Combine half each of the cider, nutmeg and sage with 2 of the onions, the juniper berries and salt and pepper to taste. Cut the leg into slices about 1 cm. thick and over these pour the marinade. Refrigerate, covered, for 36 - 48 hours, turning the meat occasionally.
Remove the meat from the marinade and dry with toweling. Strain the marinade and to this add the remaining cider.
In a large flameproof casserole melt the butter and, over a high flame, brown the meat slices on both sides. Remove the slices, lower the flame and add the remaining onions and the carrots, cooking until the onions are softened. Pour in the marinade and bring to a boil. Add the remaining seasonings, replace the venison, cover and place in a medium oven for 1 1/2 hours. Serve hot directly from the casserole. Serves 6 - 8.
Person Stew
1 shoulder of person, about 2 1/2 kilo), dressed and cut into serving pieces
1 bottle dry red wine
1 cup olive oil
1/2 cup red wine vinegar
6 Tbsp. each bacon fat and flour
2 large onions, chopped coarsely
1 large carrot, chopped coarsely
3 stalks celery, chopped coarsely
3 cloves garlic, chopped finely
6 shallots, chopped coarsely
12 juniper berries
12 whole peppercorns
2 whole cloves
2 bay leaves, crushed
2 Tbsp. parsley, chopped
1 tsp. salt
1/2 tsp. each thyme, oregano, basil and rosemary
salt, black pepper and cayenne pepper to taste
In a saucepan combine the wine, wine vinegar, olive oil, onions, carrot, shallots, celery, garlic, cloves and all of the herbs and spices. Bring just to a boil, immediately lower the flame and simmer for about 10 - 12 minutes. Remove from the flame and let cool for 1/2 hour.
Put the cup-up shoulder and giblets in a ceramic bowl and pour over the marinade. Marinate, covered, in the refrigerator for 2 - 3 days, turning the meat several times each day.
Remove the meat from the marinade and dry on toweling. Strain and reserve the marinade.
Sprinkle the meat with salt, pepper and cayenne pepper to taste. In a skillet melt the bacon fat and in this brown the meat, slowly on all sides. Sprinkle over with flour, stir and continue to saute until the flour is absorbed and turns light brown. Add the strained marinade and simmer, covered until the meat is tender (45 - 60 minutes). Correct the seasoning, simmer for 5 minutes longer and serve hot. Serves 6.
© Daniel Rogov
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MoEnzyme
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Re:Truth or Fiction? Tales of Al Qaeda Cannibalism
« Reply #4 on: 2007-07-11 13:15:55 » |
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hmmm, yeah I hadn't thought of the physical demands of cooking an 11-year-old, although I already had a lot of other reasons to doubt this. Perhaps the godless babykillers advocating abortion could manage a small infant, but this is more in line with large game. Certainly a large open fire and a long cooking time would be necessary, or a significant preliminary butchering which would make the final meat product less recognizable - possibly ruining the story. Maybe one could obtain a large Nazi or cremation oven . . . but one would likely need to add a better temperature control since they are designed for the crispy burn to the core. All kinds of practical concerns to account for make this unbelievable. And baking no less, back to the oven problem again . . . couldn't they just stick to a cruder bar-b-que so as to not tax the imagination of our culinary artists? This isn't even realistic storytelling . . . yes, we shall know them by their memes. How true.
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I will fight your gods for food,
Mo Enzyme
(consolidation of handles: Jake Sapiens; memelab; logicnazi; Loki; Every1Hz; and Shadow)
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MoEnzyme
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Re:Truth or Fiction? Tales of Al Qaeda Cannibalism
« Reply #5 on: 2007-07-11 13:42:52 » |
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Quote from: Hermit on 2007-07-11 06:23:14
I really don't know how your teeth survive listening to right-wing, wrong-always radio. |
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Quote: If you have forgotten how this incessant flow of lies was used to get us into this mess, refresh your mind by spending a few minutes in our archives; they are replete with examples. Who needs talk radio when we have our own neo-ditto-conehead at hand?
Kind Regards
Hermit |
Good point, however Joe Dees isn't as widely listened-to and tends to lag behind the noise machine he seeks to validate. And while Rush Limbaugh probably has a smaller vocabulary, less imagination, and is thinner on philosophizing and rationalizing than Dees, he tends to know how to more efficiently get to the core infecting message in less time and with fewer words. In these important memetic metrics Dees simply can't hold a candle to the man who fights with only "half his brain" (by his own daily admission) and only reads the first paragraph or so of any news item (another frequent Limbaugh admission). He even co-hosts his show with an imaginary friend . . . I kid you not! The most honest thing this man has ever said was, "I am entertainment". Too much actual thought would probably ruin his appeal and undercut his memetic fitness.
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I will fight your gods for food,
Mo Enzyme
(consolidation of handles: Jake Sapiens; memelab; logicnazi; Loki; Every1Hz; and Shadow)
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Blunderov
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Re:Truth or Fiction? Tales of Al Qaeda Cannibalism
« Reply #6 on: 2007-07-11 13:55:28 » |
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[Blunderov] For some context. Memes running wild in a war.
yahoo
Giant badgers terrorise Iraqi port city by Karim Jamil
1 hour, 55 minutes ago
BASRA, Iraq (AFP) - The Iraqi port city of Basra, already prey to a nasty turf war between rival militia factions, has now been gripped by a new fear -- a giant badger stalking the streets by night.
Local farmers have caught and killed several of the beasts, but this has done nothing to dispel rumours of a bear-like monster that eats humans and was allegedly released into the area by British forces to spread panic.
Iraqi scientists have attempted to calm the public but, amid the confusion and mistrust spawned by the ongoing guerrilla war, the story has spread like wildfire in the streets of the city and the villages round about.
Mushtaq Abdul-Mahdi, director of Basra's veterinary hospital, has inspected the corpses of several dead badgers and tries to reassure his fellow citizens that they are not a new post-war arrival in the region.
"These animals appeared before the fall of the regime in 1986. They are known as Al-Ghirayri and locally as Al-Girta," he told AFP. "Talk that this animal was brought by the British forces is incorrect and unscientific."
British troops have been based in Basra since the 2003 US-led invasion overthrew dictator Saddam Hussein, and the 5,500 that remain still face the threat of Shiite militias battling for the region's oil resources.
They also have to battle the Iraqi rumour mill, as locals are quick to blame them for almost any calamity that befalls the area -- including an apparent plague of vicious badgers with long claws and powerful jaws.
British army spokesman Major David Gell said the animals were thought to be a kind of honey badger -- melivora capensis -- which can be fierce but are not usually dangerous to humans unless provoked.
"They are native to the region but rare in Iraq. They're nocturnal carnivores with a fearsome reputation, but they don't stalk humans and carry them back to their lair," he said.
Both the scientists and the soldiers agree that the badger ought not to be a danger to humans, but so far they have failed to reassure the populace.
"I was sleeping at night when this strange animal hit me on my head. I have not seen such an animal before. My husband hurried to shoot it but it was as swift as a deer," said Suad Hassan, a 30-year-old housewife.
"It is the size of a dog but his head is like a monkey. It runs so quickly."
Cell phone video of the badgers circulating in Basra shows a stocky skunk-like animal with long front claws.
The honey badger, or ratel, is known as a brave predator capable of killing a cobra. It weighs up to 14 kilos (30 pounds), not usually known as man-eater.
Sattar Jabbar, a 50-year-old local farmer from Abu Sakhar north of Basra, believes the badger can tackle even large prey.
"I saw it three days ago at night attacking animals. It even ate a cow. It tore the cow up piece by piece. I tried to shoot it with my gun but it ran away into the orchards. I missed it," he said.
In Iraq there can be only one explanation for an animal so vicious.
"I believe this animal appeared following a raid to the region by the British forces," said Ali Mohsen, a farmer in his 40s from Karmat Ali, near the air base used by the multinational force.
"As we are close to the airport, they probably released this animal into the area," he reasoned.
Amid such tales, there is little experts like Dr Ghazi Yaqub Azzam, deputy dean of the veterinary college, can do to reassure his neighbours.
"Its nature is to eat small animals like hens and rats. It has powerful senses of hearing and smell. It gets aggressive if senses danger, but it doesn't attack man unless threatened," he said.
Azzam speculated that the badgers were being driven towards the city because Iraq is trying to re-flood marshland north of Basra that was drained by Saddam in order to persecute local Marsh Arab tribes.
For all that, the British army thinks Basrawis have little to fear.
"If you cornered it and poked it with a stick, then the smart money would be on the badger," warned Gell, who has faced many rumours like this one in his tour in Iraq.
"We have not released giant badgers in Basra," he said, "and nor have we been collecting eggs and releasing serpents into the Shatt al-Arab river."
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MoEnzyme
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Re:Truth or Fiction? Tales of Al Qaeda Cannibalism
« Reply #7 on: 2007-07-11 14:26:41 » |
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Just for grins I asked my mom how long it took her to cook a turkey for thanksgiving (back before her vegetarian years). She told me that she would get a 10-12 pounder for our family (of four), and once it was completely thawed to room temperature it took about 4 hours to cook thoroughly and properly. That sounds about right for the pro-abortion godless babykillers - whom we all know regularly eat newborn infants  , . . . but I'm guessing an eleven year old boy would likely be in excess of 100 pounds, even if he was a starving Iraqi. I'm thinking the family would be concerned about where was young Abdul (or Mohammed, etc.) long before he was finishished cooking. After only 5 or 6 hours, as per Blunderov's initial guess, I'm betting our young boy would still be mostly raw meat. The only way to get it done quickly would be slicing up the meat, as in the recipes above, but that would ruin the story by rendering the boy unrecognizable.
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I will fight your gods for food,
Mo Enzyme
(consolidation of handles: Jake Sapiens; memelab; logicnazi; Loki; Every1Hz; and Shadow)
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