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rhinoceros
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Planning against oil dependency
« on: 2004-06-07 15:51:20 »
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[rhinoceros]
The following article is about planning against oil dependency. What do you think?

(a) Is government planning for the future a good idea?
(b) Would you rather leave the market alone to sort it out?
(c) Is it a mute question because it will be (a)=(b) whatever you do?


Americans must fight petroleum addiction
By Dan Gillmor
http://www.siliconvalley.com/mld/siliconvalley/8852934.htm

<snip>
The cost of our addiction to oil can be counted not just in the money we pay to OPEC and the multinational oil giants, says Severin Borenstein, director of the University of California Energy Institute and professor of business administration and public policy at the University of California's Haas School of Business.

The lives lost and uncounted dollars spent in Iraq and elsewhere in the Middle East are part of the cost. So are the ill effects on our health and economy from pollution, congestion and accidents.

The market does wonders in many contexts. Prices rise, people consume less and substitute, entrepreneurs find new ways to do things and, ultimately, it all works out. But the market sometimes needs help.

The nation used about 375 million gallons of gasoline a day in March, according to federal statistics, an annual consumption rate of about 135 billion gallons. (California uses about 40 million gallons a day, says Borenstein.)

A 50-cent additional federal tax would curb a certain amount of consumption. But let's assume, very conservatively, that it would raise somewhere around $50 billion a year.

That kind of money would go a long way if we used it right. Here are some suggestions:

First, drastically increase federal research and development. Much of that should go toward conservation and efficiency.

Funding efficiency research is cost-effective. In 2001, the National Research Council found that the federal Department of Energy had gotten at least a 3-to-1 return on its investment in such research. (It was probably much more, when the impact on overall energy usage in the economy was calculated.)

Sustainable-energy advocates have called for a doubling of spending on basic energy R&D in the next few years.

Think of this as "a necessary down payment on the kinds of investment we need in the next few decades to get us to sustainable energy economy," says Bill Prindle, deputy director of the American Council for an Energy-Efficient Economy (www.aceee.org) in Washington. "It's more and more obvious we can't rely on conventional fossil fuels. We have to increase the rate at which efficiency improves."

Mass transit

Second, we should invest in a serious program of mass transit, and not the kind that sucks up most of the transit dollars now. Let's face the fact that rail, while it has a place in an overall mix, has become a bottomless money pit in an increasingly suburban society.

A comprehensive system of buses -- with dedicated bus lanes on major highways -- combined with a feeder system of jitney-like vans and smaller buses would need large subsidies at first, and maybe on an ongoing basis. But it would reduce those ugly side effects of our gasoline habit.

Raising the price of fuel would be painful for some of us, and we shouldn't discount that effect. I don't want to make more trouble for the millions who are struggling to make ends meet now, even in the interest of improving our overall situation.

We could use some of the money we would raise with higher fuel taxes to provide tax rebates and credits to the working poor. Many of them drive the older, gas-eating, polluting clunkers, moreover, and we could subsidize their purchase of newer, more efficient and less polluting cars.

Fewer car trips

In the long run, though, fewer car trips should be the goal. We should more strongly encourage telecommuting and mixed-use real-estate zoning, where people can live, shop and work in the same neighborhoods. States and communities will have to be persuaded -- with carrots and sticks -- to bring their laws into an age where society's larger goals are part of the equation.

Four weeks from now we'll celebrate Independence Day. Let's declare independence from fossil fuels -- and mean it this time. Let's wean ourselves from our politically, environmentally and economically dangerous energy addictions.

I spent $40 for that tank of gas last week. I'd gladly have spent $50 if I'd known the difference would be a serious investment in our future.

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Re: virus: Planning against oil dependency
« Reply #1 on: 2004-06-07 16:34:15 »
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"We think in generalities, we live in details"

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RE: virus: Planning against oil dependency
« Reply #2 on: 2004-06-07 17:28:07 »
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joedees@bellsouth.net
Sent: 07 June 2004 10:34 PM

>
    Our main short-term problem is that no new domestic refinery
has been built in 30 years, and no foreign refinery has been built in 20,
at the same time that the exploding Chinese ecenomy is demanding
more and more gasoline by leaps and bounds.  It doesn't matter how
much oil you can pump from the ground, if the ceiling on how much can
be refined into gasoline persists.
    ANWR is going to be tapped from offshore soon, and Russia's
Caspian Sea oil reserves will also be coming online within the next
decade.  Howver, in the long term, we will deplete our oil reserves. One
solution is to extract oil from Canada's massive oil shale reserves, but,
due to the relatively high (in comparison to pumping from pools) cost of
such extraction, such extraction is not presently economically feasible. 
When oil becomes more expensive than energy alternatives, the market
will naturally favor the alternatives - but not until then.
>
[Blunderov] Possibly this economic scenario could be encouraged by taxation
policy? Instead of the blanket tax cuts of supply-side strategy, the tax
breaks could be heavily skewed in favour domestic investment in alternative
energy R+D.

I'm wondering whether the trickle-down theory, as currently applied, has not
overlooked the degree of globalization that has taken place since Reagan's
80's. (PC's were by no means common in 1980, neither was there much of an
internet!) Instead of investment trickling down to the bottom of the
pyramid, there seems to be reason to suspect that it might be leaching out
to other, more attractive, pyramids.

IMO there are so many good reasons for the USA, and the world, to phase out
its dependence on oil that it amounts to recklessness not to pursue every
possible means to do this.

Best Regards


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RE: virus: Planning against oil dependency
« Reply #3 on: 2004-06-07 17:40:57 »
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rhinoceros
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Re:Planning against oil dependency
« Reply #4 on: 2004-06-07 17:54:47 »
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[rhinoceros 1]
The following article is about planning against oil dependency. What do you think?

(a) Is government planning for the future a good idea?
(b) Would you rather leave the market alone to sort it out?
(c) Is it a mute question because it will be (a)=(b) whatever you do?

Americans must fight petroleum addiction
By Dan Gillmor
http://www.siliconvalley.com/mld/siliconvalley/8852934.htm
<snip>


[Joe Dees]
    Our main short-term problem is that no new domestic refinery has been built in 30 years, and no foreign refinery has been built in 20, at the same time that the exploding Chinese ecenomy is demanding more and more gasoline by leaps and bounds.  It doesn't matter how much oil you can pump from the ground, if the ceiling on how much can be refined into gasoline persists.
    ANWR is going to be tapped from offshore soon, and Russia's Caspian Sea oil reserves will also be coming online within the next decade.  Howver, in the long term, we will deplete our oil reserves. One solution is to extract oil from Canada's massive oil shale reserves, but, due to the relatively high (in comparison to pumping from pools) cost of such extraction, such extraction is not presently economically feasible. When oil becomes more expensive than energy alternatives, the market will naturally favor the alternatives - but not until then.


[rhinoceros 2]
I take it that Joe goes with option (b), "let the market alone," and he doesn't think much of the issues in the article as long as oil can be drilled anywhere in the world and refined. (But wasn't it the US oil industry itself that pleaded for government assistance back in 1998 when OPEC was dumping cheap oil.)

The prediction that there will be a bottleneck at the refineries in the future is somehow surprising. If Joe's information is correct, then the refineries built 20-30 years ago are still able to handle the load easily. Is it too hard for the Chinese or anyone to build new ones whenever they need them? Is it a secret art? We have at least two in Greece, at Aspropyrgos and Eleusis -- regretably, the home of the ancient Eleusinian Mysteries, where spring and fertility were celebrated:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eleusinian_mysteries

By the way, I found an interesting debate (if not quite fresh  -- dated Sept. 2000), also during an "all time high", featuring several experts as well as Al Gore and the Shrub:

Tapping the Oil Reserves
http://www.pbs.org/newshour/bb/economy/july-dec00/oil_9-21.html

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Re: virus: Re:Planning against oil dependency
« Reply #5 on: 2004-06-07 18:13:17 »
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Re: virus: Re:Planning against oil dependency
« Reply #6 on: 2004-06-07 22:01:43 »
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: (a) Is government planning for the future a good idea?

Yes, and the must be willing to change the plan at a moments notice if new data doesn't sufficiently correlate with expected results.  A quarterly reevaluation of the plan, with a graceful shutdown of the plan if it is failing would be a good example.

:: (b) Would you rather leave the market alone to sort it out?

Yes!  But that would include the government's meddling in the middle east and Bush's ties to OPEC, etc.  It's too messy to say “let the market sort it out” at this point.

:: (c) Is it a mute question because it will be (a)=(b) whatever you do?

(Moot not mute) There is no way we can logically extract government meddling from energy.  Energy and government go hand in hand.  Enron, world bank, etc.
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First, read Bruce Sterling's "Distraction", and then read http://electionmethods.org.
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Re: virus: Planning against oil dependency
« Reply #7 on: 2004-06-08 00:20:34 »
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: President Carter did this. Nothing : much came of it except ethanol,
: which made practically no impact.

Serious national alternative energy development is a 10 year program needing 40 plus billion.  Not an unfunded bullshit 2 year program run by a President without the backing of American industrialists.

It doesn't matter, though.  Wind power is already cheaper than oil in many places.  Solar is cheaper than oil in southern california (thanks to Enron!!) 

As long as oil prices stay high, distributed alternative energy will win out.
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Re: virus: Planning against oil dependency
« Reply #8 on: 2004-06-08 00:49:36 »
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Re: virus: Planning against oil dependency
« Reply #9 on: 2004-06-08 09:48:07 »
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Easy enough to charge a car.

Electrics have better acceleration too - will always beat an oil car accelerating, merging, etc.
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Re:Planning against oil dependency
« Reply #10 on: 2004-06-10 05:15:43 »
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Re:Planning against oil dependency
« Reply #11 on: 2004-06-13 23:39:32 »
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