Re: virus: Androgynetics

Zloduska (
Sun, 02 May 1999 00:04:51 -0500

Wade wrote:

Um, we are still talking on different wavelengths here.

>- to make this clear- tag on- because only the _attracted_ people will
>mate, and all good eugeneticists want the cream of the crop....

This I understand, but...

I should point out that you have the definition of "androgynous" and "androgyne" confused. They are two completely different things. Androgynous people, as you said, resemble or mimic the opposite sex, or are mistaken for the opposite sex. An androgyne, according to definition #3 of that on-line glossary, is "A person
who rejects gender roles entirely. " That's me. Personally, that means that I don't identify myself as only 'female' or only 'male', and I don't think that women should act like women, and men like men. Because I believe there isn't some kind of 'norm' for all people which dictates your gender. Like you said, [to paraphrase] "gender is what you think you are". For me, the lines are too blurred for people to be separated into those two groups. I know many men who have a lot of feminine qualities, and I also have many masculine ones. But that doesn't mean I look like Pat! Hardly!

>_Some_ people have proposed that the new androgyneity/homosexuality
>trends are 'Gaia' doing its job.... Now there's a meme....

Sorry, but what's 'Gaia'? And do you really think it's a "trend"? I thought men have been shagging men and vice versa for ages. Only, in the closet, so to speak. I guess you could say that *open* homosexuality is a little bit of a trend in some areas, but the preference/behavior itself is not.

>No, no insult. It does mean, however, that, since I regard myself as a
>flaming heterosexual, androgynes are not attractive to _me_, and, since I

How do you know androgynes are not attractive to you? You can't tell a person is one by looking at them.

>am what I read as a youth, Heinlein's views of sexual society are strong
>in my nature- the best examples of men and women are also the most 'male'
>and 'female'. (And both are intelligent.) If you are truly androgynous,
>you may feel completely safe in my presence. Some women find _that_

No, I'm not truly androgynous. In fact I'm quite 'femme', and I've never been mistaken to be a male in my entire life. It's rare to feel "completely safe" in the presence of most men. It's surprising, I've discovered that I cannot even trust all of my close male friends. Perhaps that's I why I love to hang out with gay men so much, because it's unthreatening and what would normally be considered flirtation loses all meaning. And while I'm divulging all my quirks in front of an audience, I've found that most men between the ages of 30-40 are not safe from _me_. It's a mutual attraction, and Wade, I can understand if you aren't attracted to 'manish' women, because neither am I. There are plenty of men and women out there who *are* lusting after those types. Just as we all have our favorite flavors of icecream, we all have different preferences that are totally inexplicable. And I wouldn't at all be insulted if a man wasn't attracted to me. It's a nice change when one is just friendly, and nothing more. I don't think women like to be hit on as much as men *think* they like that attention. Usually, it's downright unsettling and uncomfortable. And even if you did consider me attractive, why shouldn't I feel completely safe in your presence? I have lots of platonic guy friends.

>But this means that you need to fit all the _physical_ requirements of
>androgyneity- boyish hips, taut bosom, wide shoulders, sharp chin... as
>well as exhibit not one iota of sexual energy, not just clothe yourself
>to mimic these conditions.
>And you can't smell a certain way, either....

But to another man, that might be exactly what they are aroused by in a woman. It depends on what you seek out as 'female'. I don't fit that profile, but I think that a woman who does could be just as feminine...

>Incidentally, and for what it's worth, my body style is highly
>'feminine', and I suspect this may explain, with the fact of my deeply
>imbedded curmudgeonliness, the lack of groupies in my lobby....

Don't worry Wade, take heart- there are always freaks like me on the loose. Look in the yellow pages of the phone book for the number of your local Zloduska Chapter.