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Topic: virus: Attack on transhumanists (Read 3940 times) |
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David Lucifer
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Enlighten me.
  
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Re: virus: Attack on transhumanists
« Reply #15 on: 2004-12-11 14:17:10 » |
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Matt_Arnold wrote:
>Blunderov,
>you wondered whether anyone would really want to live forever. Well I'll tell you this much for sure, I want to stick around long enough to find out. I can always change my mind later. But at this point, we just have to work on making the choice available at all. Consider the alternative-- death. I expect that once it's been acheived, people will be astonished that anyone ever did otherwise. The coping skills our species has developed to cope with death are sour grapes.
>
Well said, Matt. I recommend reading Nick Bostrom's wonderful "The Fable
of the Dragon-Tyrant".
http://www.nickbostrom.com/fable/dragon.html
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Blunderov
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"We think in generalities, we live in details"
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RE: virus: Attack on transhumanists
« Reply #16 on: 2004-12-12 03:35:44 » |
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David Lucifer
Sent: 11 December 2004 09:17 PM
<snip>
Matt_Arnold wrote:
>Blunderov,
>you wondered whether anyone would really want to live forever. Well
I'll tell you this much for sure, I want to stick around long enough to
find out. I can always change my mind later. But at this point, we just
have to work on making the choice available at all. Consider the
alternative-- death. I expect that once it's been acheived, people will
be astonished that anyone ever did otherwise. The coping skills our
species has developed to cope with death are sour grapes.
>
Well said, Matt. I recommend reading Nick Bostrom's wonderful "The Fable
of the Dragon-Tyrant".
http://www.nickbostrom.com/fable/dragon.html</snip>
[Blunderov] I appreciate the point about "health span" as opposed to
"life span". Also, I'm not saying a three score and ten year health span
is sufficient for anyone - I would love to have a few extra wickets at
my disposal; but to live indefinitely? Consider
<snip>
The Wandering Jew: in Christian legend, character doomed to live until
the end of the world because he taunted Jesus on the way to the
Crucifixion. A reference in John 18:20–22 to an officer who struck Jesus
at his arraignment before Annas is sometimes cited as the basis for the
legend. The medieval English chronicler Roger of Wendover describes in
his Flores historiarum how an archbishop from Greater Armenia, visiting
England in 1228, reported that there was in Armenia a man formerly
called Cartaphilus who claimed he had been Pontius Pilate's doorkeeper
and had struck Jesus on his way to Calvary, urging him to go faster.
Jesus replied, “I go, and you will wait till I return.” Cartaphilus was
later baptized Joseph and lived piously among Christian clergy, hoping
in the end to be saved. An Italian variant of the story named the
culprit as Giovanni Buttadeo (“Strike God”).
The legend was revived in 1602 in a German pamphlet, “Kurze Beschreibung
und Erzählung von einem Juden mit namen Ahasverus” (“A Brief Description
and Narration Regarding a Jew Named Ahasuerus”). This version, in which
the name Ahasuerus is first given to the wanderer, who was not baptized,
describes how at Hamburg in 1542 Paulus von Eitzen (d. 1598), a Lutheran
bishop of Schleswig, Ger., met an aged Jew who claimed to have taunted
Jesus on the way to the Crucifixion. He received the reply “I stand and
rest, but you will go on.” The popularity of the pamphlet may have been
the result of the anti-Jewish feeling aroused by the belief that the
Antichrist would appear in 1600 and be aided by the Jews. The pamphlet
was rapidly translated into other languages of Protestant Europe.
Appearances of the wandering Jew were frequently reported in various
European cities. As late as 1868 he was reputedly seen in Salt Lake
City, Utah.
The wandering Jew has been the subject of many plays, poems, novels, and
works of visual art. One of the best-known literary treatments is Eugène
Sue's Romantic novel Le Juif errant, 10 vol. (1844–45; The Wandering
Jew), but this anti-Jesuit melodrama has little to do with the original
legend. Gustave Doré produced a series of 12 wood engravings on the
theme in 1856.
Copyright © 1994-2002 Encyclopædia Britannica, Inc. </snip>
[Blunderov] I would add that perhaps the bible speaks more truly than
its followers properly appreciate if we consider the phrase "the peace
of God, which passeth all understanding" in the context of the Wandering
Jew.
Best Regards
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Matt Arnold
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The Electric Monk
     
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Re:virus: Attack on transhumanists
« Reply #17 on: 2004-12-13 10:33:08 » |
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Quote from: David Lucifer on 2004-12-11 14:17:10 David,
I've read it, and I'm fully on board with it. I often post this link.
Blunderov,
why do you post the story of the wandering Jew? If this story was true, why would his condition be a curse and not a blessing?
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He believed in a door. The door was the way to... to... The Door was The Way. Good. Capital letters were always the best way of dealing with things you didn't have a good answer to.
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Blunderov
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"We think in generalities, we live in details"
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RE: virus: Attack on transhumanists
« Reply #18 on: 2004-12-13 13:14:53 » |
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Matt_Arnold
Sent: 13 December 2004 05:33 PM
<snip>
Blunderov,
why do you post the story of the wandering Jew? If this story was true,
why would his condition be a curse and not a blessing? </snip>
[Blunderov] I suppose it's depends on your POV. Certainly the story
implies that this hyper-extended lifespan was intended as retribution.
And by all accounts the poor old Wandering Jew considered it to be just
that even though he was perfectly healthy.
Not everybody, I concede, would necessarily be as disconcerted as he was
by this 'punishment'.
Apropos enduring very long periods of time:
Rowan Atkinson's devil sketch
http://www.maths.tcd.ie/~afarrell/things/Hell.html
Hello, nice to see you all again.
As the more perceptive of you have probably realised by now - this is
hell, and I am the Devil. Good evening. You can call me Toby, if you
like - we try and keep things informal down here, as well as infernal.
Now, you're all here for eternity, which I hardly need tell you is a sod
of a long time, so you get to know everyone pretty well by the end, but
for now I'll have to split you up into groups.
Are there any questions?
No, I'm afraid we don't have any toilets, if you'd read your bible you
would have seen that it was damnation without relief. So, I'm afraid if
you didn't go before you came then you're not going to enjoy yourself
very much, but then, I believe that's the general idea.
Right, let's split you up then.
Can you all hear me?
CAN YOU HEAR ME AT THE RACK?
Off we go...
Murderers, over here. Looters and pillagers - over there please, thieves
if you could join them, and BANKMANAGERS.
Fornicators, if you could step forward - My God there are a lot of you.
Could I split you up into adulterers and the rest? Adulterers if you
could just form a line in front of that small guillotine there.
AMERICANS, are you here? I'm sorry about this, apparently God had some
fracas with your founding fathers and damned the entire race into
perpetuity. He sends particular condolences to the Mormans who He
realises put in a lot of work. The Iranians, I'm afraid, couldn't be
with us - someone's been holding them in purgatory for the last nine
months.
Sodomites, over there against the wall.
Atheists, over here please. You must be feeling a right bunch of
charlies.
Christians, ah yes, I'm afraid the Jews were right.
Moonies, maniacs, marmite eaters, male models, masochists, mass
murderers and masseurs, if you could take a pew at the back - with the
Methodists that is.
Now, you're the lot who used to kill whales, is that right? Ah, yes, I
must remember - I've got some strips to tear off you bastards later.
Everyone who saw Monty Pythons' "Life of Brian", I'm afraid He can't
take a joke after all.
Alright now, one final thing - we're trying to implement some sort of
exchange scheme with the Lord God Almighty, or Cliff as we know him.
Some of you will spend a decade in heaven and we're having some angels
down here. Now, I hardly need tell you that you will be expected to
behave in an exemplary manner, so, I hope you will do the exact opposite
- tear off their wings, use their haloes for frisbee practice, that sort
of thing.
Well, I have to go now, but Beelzebub here will show you the ropes,
chains, and electrodes.
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