logo Welcome, Guest. Please Login or Register.
2024-03-28 13:06:40 CoV Wiki
Learn more about the Church of Virus
Home Help Search Login Register
News: Check out the IRC chat feature.

  Church of Virus BBS
  General
  Church Doctrine

  new vote: same sex marriage
« previous next »
Pages: 1 [2] 3 Reply Notify of replies Send the topic Print 
   Author  Topic: new vote: same sex marriage  (Read 9002 times)
Blunderov
Archon
*****

Gender: Male
Posts: 3160
Reputation: 8.85
Rate Blunderov



"We think in generalities, we live in details"

View Profile WWW E-Mail
Re:new vote: same sex marriage
« Reply #15 on: 2007-09-07 03:43:41 »
Reply with quote

[Blunderov] Dear Bass, one hardly knows where to begin. You seem unclear as to whether homosexuality is a choice or a genetic predisposition. You do seem clear that, whatever the origin of homosexuality, you do not approve of it. It seems you especially do not approve of the idea of gay marriage on the basis that it does not fit in with the "original" definition of marriage as being between a man and a woman.

This is a rather unsophisticated view. You might care to peruse a more meaningful overview of the matter than you appear to have derived so far at

http://plato.stanford.edu/entries/homosexuality/

En passant, you said elsewhere "The only excuse viable is if a female was raped. I don't even like that excuse because they make birth control pills, which the majority of women can afford". Do I understand you to be saying that women should take the pill incase they get raped?

As a rule I try to avoid making personal observations especially on the net. But it does seem to me that you a very steeped in popular prejudices especially those pertaining to sex. Where did you get that stuff from?If you hang around the CoV we can deprogram you bit by bit. What you do have going on is an apparent willingness to learn.

This is good.

Report to moderator   Logged
MoEnzyme
Heretic
*****

Gender: Male
Posts: 2256
Reputation: 1.66
Rate MoEnzyme



infidel lab animal

View Profile WWW
Re:new vote: same sex marriage
« Reply #16 on: 2007-09-07 11:50:06 »
Reply with quote

[[ author reputation (1.66) beneath threshold (3)... display message ]]

Report to moderator   Logged

I will fight your gods for food,
Mo Enzyme


(consolidation of handles: Jake Sapiens; memelab; logicnazi; Loki; Every1Hz; and Shadow)
Hermit
Archon
*****

Posts: 4290
Reputation: 8.92
Rate Hermit



Prime example of a practically perfect person

View Profile WWW
Re:new vote: same sex marriage
« Reply #17 on: 2007-09-07 17:49:37 »
Reply with quote

Many studies have shown that one of the strongest correlators for a latent homosexual orientation is the degree of homophobia and bigotry displayed by the subject.  I have sometimes wondered if the best promotion of an alternative lifestyle might be getting too close to a heterosexual bigot. I wonder if this story, though anecdotal, might suggest a reply to that question.

Hermit

Report to moderator   Logged

With or without religion, you would have good people doing good things and evil people doing evil things. But for good people to do evil things, that takes religion. - Steven Weinberg, 1999
Walter Watts
Archon
*****

Gender: Male
Posts: 1571
Reputation: 8.85
Rate Walter Watts



Just when I thought I was out-they pull me back in

View Profile WWW E-Mail
Re:new vote: same sex marriage
« Reply #18 on: 2007-09-07 21:11:27 »
Reply with quote


Quote from: Bass on 2007-09-06 23:48:13   


<snip>
However, being raised in a gay family might make the child gay when he gets older. Maybe he would've turned out that way anyways even if he was raised in a straight household. But then again, maybe not.  :-

For example: My ex-girlfriend wasn't born bisexual. She had an experience with a friend and therefore started to like girls as well. So I find it hard to believe that anyone is born gay.

<snip>



I'm gonna bite my tongue and avoid making an ad-hominem ass of myself.

That aside, the above statements are the dumbest I've seen from a CoV member in as long as I can remember.


Walter
Report to moderator   Logged

Walter Watts
Tulsa Network Solutions, Inc.


No one gets to see the Wizard! Not nobody! Not no how!
teh
Archon
**

Posts: 65
Reputation: 8.64
Rate teh



I'm still still learning

View Profile E-Mail
Re:new vote: same sex marriage
« Reply #19 on: 2007-09-09 00:41:36 »
Reply with quote

[Bass]If your friend wants to adopt a kid but wants the kid to grow up to be his own person then that is fine. However, being raised in a gay family might make the child gay when he gets older. Maybe he would've turned out that way anyways even if he was raised in a straight household. But then again, maybe not. 

[teh] It is so obvious that you have no meaningfull friendship with anyone gay. And any experience or contact with "the gay people" is of the flamming camp queens or the emotionally scarred variety.

I really do pity your blinkered "Will & Grace"/"The Bird Cage" view of homosexuals and homosexual parents.


[Bass]For example: My ex-girlfriend wasn't born bisexual. She had an experience with a friend and therefore started to like girls as well. So I find it hard to believe that anyone is born gay.

[teh] Since we've entered the no brains cliche zone, maybe her experience with you was so awful that she was put off men. (I know, that was a very cheap shot. I'm surprised no one else went for it, I've got multiple lacerations from biting my tongue for an entire day now)

Lets not confuse matters Bass.
Some people have latent homosexuality were their sexual orientation is suppressed (repressed even) due to many causes such as social, religious or other pressures.

It may seem like it's a choice, but don't kid yourself, it's simply been waiting to happen.
Just take a look at any country which treats homosexuality as a taboo, It's not the persons choice to not be gay, it's the persons choice to repress themselves and act out a hetero life for the remainder of their life.

Others simply want to experiment, usually, but not restricted to, their teens or their early 20s.

I honestly suggest you have a good read of the link posted by Blunderov

Here's another link, yes it's wikipedia again. Homosexuality

May the light of knowledge smack you upside the head.
Teh

(ps. hilarious link Mo)
« Last Edit: 2007-09-09 00:58:24 by teh » Report to moderator   Logged
Walter Watts
Archon
*****

Gender: Male
Posts: 1571
Reputation: 8.85
Rate Walter Watts



Just when I thought I was out-they pull me back in

View Profile WWW E-Mail
Re:new vote: same sex marriage
« Reply #20 on: 2007-09-10 03:33:27 »
Reply with quote


Quote from: Bass on 2007-09-06 23:48:13   


<snip>
If your friend wants to adopt a kid but wants the kid to grow up to be his own person then that is fine. However, being raised in a gay family might make the child gay when he gets older. Maybe he would've turned out that way anyways even if he was raised in a straight household. But then again, maybe not.  :-

For example: My ex-girlfriend wasn't born bisexual. She had an experience with a friend and therefore started to like girls as well. So I find it hard to believe that anyone is born gay.
<snip>


So, umm, Bass, if you're not born gay and it's a choice, then pray tell us the following:

Exactly when did you decide you didn't like sucking cocks?

Signed,
Curious-on-a-stick

Walter
Report to moderator   Logged

Walter Watts
Tulsa Network Solutions, Inc.


No one gets to see the Wizard! Not nobody! Not no how!
teh
Archon
**

Posts: 65
Reputation: 8.64
Rate teh



I'm still still learning

View Profile E-Mail
Re:new vote: same sex marriage
« Reply #21 on: 2007-09-10 08:23:28 »
Reply with quote

The CoV loves you Bass

Want to cuddle ? 

Report to moderator   Logged
MoEnzyme
Heretic
*****

Gender: Male
Posts: 2256
Reputation: 1.66
Rate MoEnzyme



infidel lab animal

View Profile WWW
Re:new vote: same sex marriage
« Reply #22 on: 2007-09-10 15:12:49 »
Reply with quote

[[ author reputation (1.66) beneath threshold (3)... display message ]]

« Last Edit: 2007-09-10 15:41:04 by Mo » Report to moderator   Logged

I will fight your gods for food,
Mo Enzyme


(consolidation of handles: Jake Sapiens; memelab; logicnazi; Loki; Every1Hz; and Shadow)
Bass
Magister
***

Posts: 196
Reputation: 6.80
Rate Bass



I'm a llama!

View Profile
Re:new vote: same sex marriage
« Reply #23 on: 2007-09-12 12:20:04 »
Reply with quote

First and foremost, I have nothing against homosexuals, only some concerns over the (possibly) repercussions of gay marriage. But this isn’t something I know a lot about, so please don’t be offended by (or attack) my ignorance here. That’s not very reasonable.

Secondly; Blunderov. Taking the pill in the unfortunate event of rape would be a positive reason would it not? I’m not saying that people plan ahead for this type of horrendous experience but controlling (whether intended or not) such undesired pregnancy would a good thing from what I can see.

Thirdly; teh. That’s the last time I share and intermit and personal relationship on here.

Finally; Walter. Objectively speaking I have never “sucked cocks” – as you so eloquently put it. But, subjectively, I have had both the curiosity and the experience of similar thoughts, and no I did not (personally) enjoy the thought. Why? Because that’s not who I am. Simple. If I did not (personally) like the thought of it, and times that by the fact that men just simply don’t arouse me, well… there’s your answer.

For everyone who thinks that Homosexuality is instinctive at birth, here's what I think you're missing (this is just hypothetical thinking):

1) Assume 2 polar magnets. A negative charge and a positive charge. Now if you stick two similar ends, will they repel or attract? You can think that they can stick together and that its perfectly normal, but when really, its not meant to be. Religion does not however, imo, have anything to do with this nature of things.

2) There are pretty much two major hormones. Oestrogen and Testosterone. That pretty much sums up whether you are a girl or a boy. Technically, oestrogen only has a bonded H molecule more than testosterone, meaning that through genetics, there was meant to be a difference. That single molecule gives you so many different characteristics compared to the other sex. Whether the hormones build the female or male reproduction system, its goal was one thing...allow reproduction. Imbalance of these hormones can only make a rare merge of female and male characteristics. Meaning wide shoulders and beards on women whereas men have larger breast and narrow shoulders.

My point in this is that hormones bring along themselves, you cannot simply start making more oestrogen than testosterone if you had testosterone in greater amounts initially. If you did however, that would start having bodily effects on you...changes on your physique...and as far as i know, homosexuals don't have these "changes". So hormonal imbalance is not the reason for homosexuality.

3) If you were homosexual at birth, that would imply that you have something in you different than straight people (vice versa) right? If its not hormones, then what is it? DNA/Genes definitely don't account for one's orientation. Your brain does. Because if its not psychological, then what part of you is telling you prefer same sex people? Its something that you create into your mind, its what YOU want, not what others want, not what your were destined for....which might I add destiny is full of shit....and nonexistent.

Homosexuality is fine, but gay marriage cannot be accepted by the many, many people who have been taught against it...because marriage is something initially religious. Gay marriage is seen as contradictory in the sense that you are opposing religion while performing that same religion's ceremony. That’s like subtracting apples when you're picking some up.


Regards,

Bass

PS Thanks for the links, I don’t have quite the desired time to read them all through right now but I will. Actually, I probably should have read them before writing this post…

As Homer says “D’oh!”
« Last Edit: 2007-09-12 12:22:52 by Bass » Report to moderator   Logged
Walter Watts
Archon
*****

Gender: Male
Posts: 1571
Reputation: 8.85
Rate Walter Watts



Just when I thought I was out-they pull me back in

View Profile WWW E-Mail
Re:new vote: same sex marriage
« Reply #24 on: 2007-09-12 12:32:13 »
Reply with quote


Quote from: Bass on 2007-09-12 12:20:04   

First and foremost, I have nothing against homosexuals, only some concerns over the (possibly) repercussions of gay marriage. But this isn’t something I know a lot about, so please don’t be offended by (or attack) my ignorance here. That’s not very reasonable.

Secondly; Blunderov. Taking the pill in the unfortunate event of rape would be a positive reason would it not? I’m not saying that people plan ahead for this type of horrendous experience but controlling (whether intended or not) such undesired pregnancy would a good thing from what I can see.

Thirdly; teh. That’s the last time I share and intermit and personal relationship on here.

Finally; Walter. Objectively speaking I have never “sucked cocks” – as you so eloquently put it. But, subjectively, I have had both the curiosity and the experience of similar thoughts, and no I did not (personally) enjoy the thought. Why? Because that’s not who I am. Simple. If I did not (personally) like the thought of it, and times that by the fact that men just simply don’t arouse me, well… there’s your answer.

For everyone who thinks that Homosexuality is instinctive at birth, here's what I think you're missing (this is just hypothetical thinking):

1) Assume 2 polar magnets. A negative charge and a positive charge. Now if you stick two similar ends, will they repel or attract? You can think that they can stick together and that its perfectly normal, but when really, its not meant to be. Religion does not however, imo, have anything to do with this nature of things.

2) There are pretty much two major hormones. Oestrogen and Testosterone. That pretty much sums up whether you are a girl or a boy. Technically, oestrogen only has a bonded H molecule more than testosterone, meaning that through genetics, there was meant to be a difference. That single molecule gives you so many different characteristics compared to the other sex. Whether the hormones build the female or male reproduction system, its goal was one thing...allow reproduction. Imbalance of these hormones can only make a rare merge of female and male characteristics. Meaning wide shoulders and beards on women whereas men have larger breast and narrow shoulders.

My point in this is that hormones bring along themselves, you cannot simply start making more oestrogen than testosterone if you had testosterone in greater amounts initially. If you did however, that would start having bodily effects on you...changes on your physique...and as far as i know, homosexuals don't have these "changes". So hormonal imbalance is not the reason for homosexuality.

3) If you were homosexual at birth, that would imply that you have something in you different than straight people (vice versa) right? If its not hormones, then what is it? DNA/Genes definitely don't account for one's orientation. Your brain does. Because if its not psychological, then what part of you is telling you prefer same sex people? Its something that you create into your mind, its what YOU want, not what others want, not what your were destined for....which might I add destiny is full of shit....and nonexistent.

Homosexuality is fine, but gay marriage cannot be accepted by the many, many people who have been taught against it...because marriage is something initially religious. Gay marriage is seen as contradictory in the sense that you are opposing religion while performing that same religion's ceremony. That’s like subtracting apples when you're picking some up.


Regards,

Bass

PS Thanks for the links, I don’t have quite the desired time to read them all through right now but I will. Actually, I probably should have read them before writing this post…

As Homer says “D’oh!”



Some posts make me laugh.

Some posts make me sad.

Some posts make me learn.

Some posts make me scratch my head.

The above post made me join my local trepanation society.


Walter
Report to moderator   Logged

Walter Watts
Tulsa Network Solutions, Inc.


No one gets to see the Wizard! Not nobody! Not no how!
MoEnzyme
Heretic
*****

Gender: Male
Posts: 2256
Reputation: 1.66
Rate MoEnzyme



infidel lab animal

View Profile WWW
Re:new vote: same sex marriage
« Reply #25 on: 2007-09-12 13:25:53 »
Reply with quote

[[ author reputation (1.66) beneath threshold (3)... display message ]]

« Last Edit: 2007-09-12 16:26:51 by Mo » Report to moderator   Logged

I will fight your gods for food,
Mo Enzyme


(consolidation of handles: Jake Sapiens; memelab; logicnazi; Loki; Every1Hz; and Shadow)
teh
Archon
**

Posts: 65
Reputation: 8.64
Rate teh



I'm still still learning

View Profile E-Mail
Re:new vote: same sex marriage
« Reply #26 on: 2007-09-13 09:10:26 »
Reply with quote

[Bass]First and foremost, I have nothing against homosexuals, only some concerns over the (possibly) repercussions of gay marriage. But this isn't something I know a lot about, so please don't be offended by (or attack) my ignorance here. That's not very reasonable.

[teh] There are many other sources suitable for a response to this, the easiest and quickest to find is, Parenting.


[Bass]Secondly; Blunderov. Taking the pill in the unfortunate event of rape would be a positive reason would it not? I'm not saying that people plan ahead for this type of horrendous experience but controlling (whether intended or not) such undesired pregnancy would a good thing from what I can see.

[teh] The morning-after pill may be more appropriate for this purpose.
I'm not certain what this has to do with anything though?


[Bass]Thirdly; teh. That's the last time I share and intermit and personal relationship on here.

[teh] I did mention it was a cheap shot. I agree, I should not have gone down that route, even if I was aggravated by the cliches you put forward as arguments. ##eye contact averted & child like shuffling##


[Bass]PS Thanks for the links, I don't have quite the desired time to read them all through right now but I will. Actually, I probably should have read them before writing this post&#8230;

yes.
it would have been prudent.
answers to your three hypotheses
Theories on homosexuality
Report to moderator   Logged
Stringy
Archon
**

Gender: Male
Posts: 15
Reputation: 8.60
Rate Stringy



Life is a trip...and we got tickets

View Profile WWW E-Mail
Re:new vote: same sex marriage
« Reply #27 on: 2007-12-12 18:08:08 »
Reply with quote

[snips liberally utilized but unnoted]

[bass]
so please don’t be offended by (or attack) my ignorance here. That’s not very reasonable.

[stringy]
I’m confused by what I think is called an ambiguous antecedent. Is it the offense (or attack) that is “not very reasonable,” or your ignorance?

[bass]
But, subjectively, I have had both the curiosity and the experience of similar thoughts, and no I did not (personally) enjoy the thought. Why? Because that’s not who I am.

[stringy]
Is that by choice, or by nature?

[bass]
There are pretty much two major hormones. Oestrogen and Testosterone.

[stringy]
I’m no biologist, but I thought there were other major hormones. Isn’t adrenalin a hormone? But perhaps you meant two involved in gender?

[bass]
My point in this is that hormones bring along themselves, you cannot simply start making more oestrogen than testosterone if you had testosterone in greater amounts initially. If you did however, that would start having bodily effects on you...changes on your physique...and as far as i know, homosexuals don't have these "changes". So hormonal imbalance is not the reason for homosexuality.

[stringy]
Your premises do not support your conclusion: “as far as I know” is insufficient evidence.

[bass]
If you were homosexual at birth, that would imply that you have something in you different than straight people (vice versa) right?

[stringy]
Yes, being homosexual at birth would by definition mean you’re different than straight people. For a male, being homosexual could very well mean you have something different in you than straight people. But enough of the cocksucking jokes.

[bass]
DNA/Genes definitely don't account for one's orientation. Your brain does.

[stringy]
DNA/Genes account for your brain.

[bass]
Homosexuality is fine, but gay marriage cannot be accepted by the many, many people who have been taught against it...because marriage is something initially religious.

[stringy]
Perhaps initially religious, but currently it’s financial, legal, and political. Denying homosexual unions the financial benefits and legal protections is discrimination plain and simple.

On a more serious note, I'm trying to learn and use the proper CoV format for posting. I know I didn't use [snip] properly.
Report to moderator   Logged

I'm neither a scientist nor a scholar. I'm, primarily, an entertainer. That does not invalidate my ideas...but it does make them suspect.
letheomaniac
Archon
***

Gender: Female
Posts: 267
Reputation: 8.73
Rate letheomaniac





View Profile E-Mail
Re:new vote: same sex marriage
« Reply #28 on: 2007-12-13 08:51:38 »
Reply with quote

Hmmm... I personally am inclined to think that the perfect way to express your love for another human being (whether they are of the same gender as yourself or not) is definitely NOT a legally binding contract. "I love you honey. Now prove that you love me by signing on the dotted line..." How romantic. Still if you feel the need, I think that you should be allowed to marry the person of your choice regardless of their gender, so long as they are of legal age.
Report to moderator   Logged

"You can't teach an old dogma new tricks." - Dorothy Parker
Hermit
Archon
*****

Posts: 4290
Reputation: 8.92
Rate Hermit



Prime example of a practically perfect person

View Profile WWW
Re:new vote: same sex marriage
« Reply #29 on: 2007-12-13 15:30:35 »
Reply with quote

But while allowing anyone stupid enough to wish to be married,  to marry anyone else irrespective of sex (and granting that a lot of the time the desire for such a contract probably should be taken as a sign that the person wishing to do so is legally incompetent on grounds of insanity), why be prejudiced and limit it to people?  If a horse was good enough for Alexander the Great, would an ass not have been appropriate for Bush*? I know many men who would be happier by far had they married their pet rocks instead of their high school sweetheart, and of course many women would be better off with neutered hamsters rather than the equally messy, unexciting creatures they end up with. But none of this is addressed here.

Kindest Regards

Hermit

*At what age should an ass be deemed to be of "legal age"? Could a falcon reach an eagle age no matter how many years it lived?  What about humans? They vary so much in mental, emotional and social capacity and age seems to have less to do with it than genetics, environment and training. Wouldn't it be more sane to have a qualification test? A responsibility and intent questionnaire? Then too, I'm strongly inclined to a separate license for breeding difficult to obtain and easy to lose..

« Last Edit: 2007-12-13 20:44:49 by Hermit » Report to moderator   Logged

With or without religion, you would have good people doing good things and evil people doing evil things. But for good people to do evil things, that takes religion. - Steven Weinberg, 1999
Pages: 1 [2] 3 Reply Notify of replies Send the topic Print 
Jump to:


Powered by MySQL Powered by PHP Church of Virus BBS | Powered by YaBB SE
© 2001-2002, YaBB SE Dev Team. All Rights Reserved.

Please support the CoV.
Valid HTML 4.01! Valid CSS! RSS feed